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Americans refusing vaccine - Pandemic reset!

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#1 by Darkstar2 » Wed Jul 28, 2021 19:32

I never thought I would ever say this, but I am just shocked and confused - What happened to the Make America Better Again, and support for Trump - it seems now that it all comes down to Republicans or other holding America hostage by refusing to take the vaccine that is the key to stop this pandemic (courtesy of China I might add) BUT now if the pandemic is trailing it's all on the people who do not want to vaccinate, you can't blame anybody else but yourself - there are effective vaccines, why not put aside those bullshit conspiracy theories and freedom crap - this is a WAR and a serious hazard I dunno what the f*ck are they waiting for to mandate vaccines for all - no ands ifs or buts, constitution should no longer apply - I mean they made extraordinary legislation after 9/11, why not do the same for this, which is far worse, especially now with the variants - what about all of us SUCKERS who got stabbed twice in the arm to take the ******mned vaccine - which in a few months will be USELESS and all for nothing, because of the many who refused a vaccine - it's all on them, and the very part that stands for making America Better is actually making America worse by turning this into politics - they should forget about Biden and forget about the joke that he is, and think of their own fate, others, the country, the economy - First round, America avoided a great depression, this time around, businesses and economy won't be able to withstand another wave - it will be a DISASTER - so come fall and winter we can expect this pandemic to reset, all start from 0, all this shit for nothing - it's time to stop thinking of politics, you are taking the vaccine, the very vaccine that TRUMP made happen, why can't Republicans represent and do the right thing, Trump made it happen when everyone else said the vaccine will take years -SO what gives ????? Majority of Republicans refuse vaccination - I mean seriously ? Do any of those Americans have jobs ? Savings ? investments ? kids ? families ? I cannot believe this - on one hand you have a joke of a Democratic President who does not have enough balls to do anything concrete other than his green shit economy and over spending on infrastructure - what ever happened to Biden's pledge to "crush the virus" (his own words during the campaign) - his performance so far in leading is MEDIOCRE at best,
I would have hoped Republicans set the right example - Trump did not make the warp speed vaccine possible for it to be ignored - it's PATHETIC, even some Canadian provinces have 75%-80% already, never thought I would see America behind - when they have far more doses of vaccines - come on - Right now it is mostly Republicans holding the country hostage, the majority of hospitalisation and deaths now are those who did not receive their 2 doses of vaccines, vaccines are effective, get the bloody vaccine for ******* out loud - there is no excuse, they should stop listening to fake news and set aside their political bullshit and get the vaccine - it's the ONLY way that the variant can be stopped in its tracks.

Otherwise, here is what will happen:

Today it is the Delta variant that is responsible - Tomorrow it will be a super variant and eventually as new variants come out, the vaccine efficacy will diminish, until it will be so low that it will be useless. So what happens now ? This pandemic will trail on forever, all because of a bunch of cock heads who mix politics and common sense, leave the BULLSHIT for politicians, do the right thing and get your vaccines !
Last edited by Darkstar2 » Thu Jul 29, 2021 13:03 » edited 1 time in total
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#2 by tasman1 » Wed Jul 28, 2021 19:41

I am to young to die from vaccine shot , nope , no vaccine
We must take big axe and split planet on half
Half for vaccinated , half for freedom lovers , that way we can start war , vaccinated V non vaccinated , winner take all
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#3 by valerie » Thu Jul 29, 2021 06:50

Speaking of fake news, you can't believe everything you read.

It does not matter if you are a republican or a democrat or an independent or
nothing at all. Some take the vaccine and some don't. There is no such thing
as a particular political group not taking the vaccine.

In fact, if one was to get down to the nitty gritty, most people in the USA do
not vote and have no real political stance.

I grew up in a time without car seatbelts. I remember the big controversy
about wearing seatbelts once vehicle manufacturers began installing them.

Eventually a law was passed that everyone must wear a seatbelt and if you
don't have it on, you can be stopped and fined.

I also grew up in a time that children could ride where ever they wanted to
in a vehicle. That goes for babies too. Now the law is, they must be
strapped in and babies must ride in the back seat.

Those are life safety laws. There were plenty of people that were against
having those laws and protested about the infringement on their rights.

Today, no one thinks about it. It's automatic. You almost do it without even
thinking about it and should you forget, the bell in your vehicle is going to
remind you to buckle up and you're thankful it does.

If they passed a law everyone must be vaccinated for covid prevention, it
would be no different than how they raised cain over other safety laws. It
would have exceptions of course, such as people with certain health conditions
that may be prone to bad reactions. But eventually, people would accept it.
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#4 by Arvind9 » Thu Jul 29, 2021 07:36

When the question is about bringing an end to a dangerous virus a vaccine should be made mandatory but its not because the vaccine development for Covid19 was initially a emergency requirement for front line workers to prevent them from dying of Covid19 infections but then governments opened it for general population its upto an individual to decide if one wants to take it or not,I am not against vaccines but an proper vaccine has to be developed that can prevent infections and have a longer effective period then even I will take it but if its only going to boost immunity to prevent death then I can wait for a proper vaccine whenever its development,its the most stupid thing you take the vaccine and still put on a mask and follow rules why the vaccine should be able to do its job of protecting
Last edited by Arvind9 » Thu Jul 29, 2021 07:44 » edited 1 time in total
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#5 by kanjoormadam09 » Thu Jul 29, 2021 09:20

You are really intelligent Sir. Most people dont know the bad consequences of vaccine available now, They are implemented without proper testing . I am also not against vaccines but will take when the right one comes and now strictly follow covid rules, If I get covid I will accept and treat it and try to not infect others.
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#6 by Darkstar2 » Thu Jul 29, 2021 12:15

tasman1 wrote: I am to young to die from vaccine shot , nope , no vaccine
We must take big axe and split planet on half
Half for vaccinated , half for freedom lovers , that way we can start war , vaccinated V non vaccinated , winner take all

Fortunately for you, the area where you live has barely any case - BUT if you were in a hot zone with a COVID variant, your odds of getting infected would be nearly certain - the variant is so much more dangerous even with protection, in fact it is likely that ALL people who were not fully vaccinated WILL eventually get infected, it's just a matter of time.
There are many who refused vaccine who are BEGGING to get the vaccine, only when they are in the ICU between life and death, only it's too late to change your mind. I'm not strong on vaccines myself I almost refused it myself, and if not for dangerous VARIANTS I probably would not have taken the vaccine at all. What changed my mind ? 1) I do not like hospitals, I do not like needles, I do not like the idea of gasping and begging to breath whilst watching myself die under a ventilator, paralysed !!! and I don't want to cause the burden on family.....So I did my part.........

Nobody DIES from vaccine, the only cases I know of are from rare complications due to Thrombosis - and so far it is with the AstraZenecca and J&J vaccines - for mRNA vaccines like Pfizer / Moderna, the complications are even more rare, and are usually treatable. My concern though are the long term health effects, in some rare cases vaccines could cause new health issues down the road, but this applies to all vaccines, and cases are rare - calculate your odds, with the Delta and new variants to come, if you are not FULLY vaccinated, it's a matter of time before everyone gets it, it's that bad. I would rather die from extremely rare complications of a vaccine than die of this virus that TORTURES people in hospitals and gives them an excruciating death ! If you have access to Moderna or Pfizer, they are safe, and you won't DIE from them, in fact the rare extreme side effects happen more in the young age group that your age group, the safety of these vaccines are very high in your age group.

Normally I would say people have the right to refuse a vaccine, their body their terms. BUT in this situation it is a DISASTER, it is an extreme health emergency - the ones who are NOT vaccinated are a severe danger to those who are vaccinated, so in such extreme cases like that, your freedom and rights should NOT apply anymore - because if enough people get infected by this ******mned variant, it will render the vaccines totally useless - it's being selfish towards the ones who got the vaccines to protect themselves and others.

I think it is time to lock people up in FEMA camps, we've come to that, no vaccine, then a person should be isolated away from society until the end of this war. It's not harsh at all, I am sick and bloody tired of hearing about innocent people dying all because of the lack of vaccination - There are provinces in Canada who will adopt measures this autumn - they obviously cannot make vaccines mandatory, but they will implement new regulations - proof of vaccination will be required for ALL non essential services - this is an alternative to shutting down the economy and locking everyone up - you didn't take your vaccine or full doses, you represent a danger to yourself and society, so you will be excluded from all non essential services and have to stay home - I think that is too generous even. So for going to pubs, restaurants, gyms, cinema, theatre and other non essential activities, you will be required to provide your vaccine certificate certifying you are fully vaccinated against COVID19.

People should be thankful there are mRNA vaccines with near perfect efficacy !!!! Other non mRNA vaccines like China, Russia, etc, have vaccines that are far lower in efficacy - they may be good enough for original strain but weak for variants - and not all countries have access to Pfizer and Moderna, and China obviously will use their own vaccine, Russia will use their own vaccine. Cases are surging a little in China, even China is not immune from variants - it goes to show you how variants are dangerous even with adherence to guidelines.
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#7 by Darkstar2 » Thu Jul 29, 2021 12:44

valerie wrote: Speaking of fake news, you can't believe everything you read.

It does not matter if you are a republican or a democrat or an independent or
nothing at all. Some take the vaccine and some don't. There is no such thing
as a particular political group not taking the vaccine.

Yes it matters - I'm not talking about the news on CNN or any media with political interests, but statistics from sources which have no vested interest in politics. Even Republican leaders made the statements themselves and are aware of the issue. A lot of things in America have turned political - the whole pandemic has turned into politics - A lot of Republican states have low vaccination compared to anything else - yes it is political - The whole election was one big sham, Republicans lost their bloody election over someone who should have normally been the least likely to win, and the least capable of running a country other than making blank promises he can never keep and over spend money - so why is it that many Republicans do not want the vaccine ? Trump made the impossible happen, everybody said he was crazy to think a vaccine could be made available by end of year, yet it happened. if Trump was in power, only he would have the balls to use unconventional methods to get results, not some SOFTY socialist of the far left - so what are Americans up to anyway, do they think that by not taking the vaccine they will sabotage Joe Biden's plans and presidency ? They are just sabotaging ALL Americans !! Of course, God forbid if all of America is vaccinated and situation gets back to normal, who will take credit, Joe Biden will scream victory - it's ironic, he would NEVER have had the balls to put enough pressure to get things done, to put pressure on the Fed's Jerome Powell, etc. Do Americans think they are punishing Biden or Biden voters by not taking the vaccines ? Of course the whole damn thing is politics Valerie, people should set aside their rivalry and BULLSHIT and think farther than their snotty nose and think of others too. People don't realise how a bunch of selfish prats they are, if they get infected, they might not give two shits, but they can infect others, friends, family - one has to be cold blooded to not give a shit.

Let's see now, even Trump tried hard to encourage Americans to get the vaccine, a vaccine he worked hard for, but on the other hand he chickened out a little by saying he supports 100% people's freedom - you see, what is that ? POLITICS - He does not want to come across as shoving the vaccine - big mistake - he has to SHOW that the situation is far more serious than people think. You see people are playing the politics card on BOTH sides, Republicans and Democrats alike - it's time to put this barrel of horse manure aside FOR NOW, and focus on this war, people should be working together regardless of their preferences, and LATER when the pandemic is over, they can resume killing one another and fighting about politics !!!! Right now with dangerous variants, vaccination mandates are overdue - and Biden does not have the BALLS to do that, because what gets him hard in the morning is the thought of winning the mid terms !!!! and Trump on the other side does not want to show himself too harsh on vaccines because he too THINKS he party can win the mid terms OR he can be re-elected in 2024 (It's gonna be hard to win against the communist party, especially Biden's successor!!!!)

Quote:
If they passed a law everyone must be vaccinated for covid prevention, it
would be no different than how they raised cain over other safety laws. It
would have exceptions of course, such as people with certain health conditions
that may be prone to bad reactions. But eventually, people would accept it.

You see, I am not one of those who like vaccines - in fact like I said, my plan was NOT to get the COVID19 vaccine, there is no way I would ever take a vaccine that took less than a year to implement when it should take years, even mentioned it on the forum last year, BUT...................things changed, WHY ? The damn variants - The whole variants thing changed completely - With original strain you needed to be exposed long enough to the virus to be infected, about 10-15 minutes to someone - with the variants - there is no gap AT ALL - it is so virulent that it does not take much at all to get infected, even with measures in place - so I decided to get vaccinated, because I did the math, I know hospital workers, I've seen of my own eyes hospital COVID19 areas, and I've had family members struck with severe versions of the virus, AND friends of family who died, friends and family who did not believe in COVID19 thinking it was a hoax who caught it - only when you are already in the ICU it's too late to have regrets and want the vaccine. I HATE vaccines, I HATE needles, my first shot was very unpleasant, it's like I went to the slaughter house, luckily my 2nd dose (another person giving the shot) was great, barely even felt needle, and yes i had much higher side effects from 2nd dose, I had 100 of fever, ALL my muscles were in pain, could barely move or stand up or walk, and of course the sore arm - it lasted 2 days at most and on day 3 back to normal. It was well damn worth it. Vaccine is more than 90% effective, and for variants it is 75-80% still very high efficacy, much higher than the Flu vaccine or other vaccines. The only time I would have refused the vaccine is if it was the Mark Of The Beast - initially that was my fear, but I realised it wasn't the Mark Of The Beast, not that, not yet. Vaccines are not mandatory, you can still buy or sell.

YES I am concerned of vaccines in the long term - they skipped some testing phases, was vaccine rushed ? A little, they only tested efficacy short term - BUT they did not test SAFETY LONG TERM. STILL, it is a risk willing ot take,
I'd rather take this tiny percent risk, than risk getting infected and ending up hooked up to needles and tubes in a hospital, with a shot of paralytic and struggling to breath and begging to die.
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#8 by Darkstar2 » Thu Jul 29, 2021 13:02

kanjoormadam09 wrote: You are really intelligent Sir. Most people dont know the bad consequences of vaccine available now, They are implemented without proper testing . I am also not against vaccines but will take when the right one comes and now strictly follow covid rules, If I get covid I will accept and treat it and try to not infect others.

As far as Pfizer and Moderna, they were implemented with proper testing - The FDA is very strict on approving vaccines. The technology behind the vaccines were studied for over 20 years - Pfizer / Moderna has run trials, and so far based on hospital data being released here, the ones who are showing up still are mostly non vaccinated people, and the % pretty much match against the data released by Pfizer/Moderna. The vaccines are safe - the only thing that was not tested is LONG TERM efficacy, and LONG TERM safety - but if relying on all vaccines in history, occurrence of long term issues is rare, occurrence of short term issues is also rare - not getting the vaccine far outweighs the risks of taking the vaccine.

As far as other non mRNA vaccines, I don't, they have not exactly released as much data - The Sputnik and Sinovac and other vaccines have shown lower efficacy, much lower. Not all countries have access to Pfizer and Moderna, they have access to the VaxZevria (Astra) and Sputnik or Sinovac, which have a lower efficacy - they are not anymore unsafe as any vaccine in history which has PROVEN to eradicate dangerous viruses.

Right now the only key to ending this pandemic is stopping the virus from spreading and developing new variants - HOW to do that ? Getting as many people vaccinated as possible, ideally 75% as a minimum, 85% optimal for variants......

I don't believe in forcing people to get ANY vaccine, I am totally against it - BUT in extreme circumstances should come extreme measures - this is an extreme emergency - the pandemic is trailing longer than expected, and as long as people are not immunised, the virus will continue to perfect itself and continue perpetually - I am sick and tired of having needles poked in my arm - at this rate we will continually need to get vaccines - WE can all end this if everyone shows good will and accepts to get the vaccines - to stop this misery - After 9/11 homeland security implemented exceptional rules, that would have once been considered anti-constitutional - governments DO have the power to override our freedoms in cases of extreme emergency - right now we ARE there, this is a severe, critical world emergency - at this point any risks from vaccines are tiny in comparison - and any long term safety issues with vaccines will be tiny in comparison to the fallout from ignoring the variants and pandemic.

If people are waiting for magical pills to cure COVID19, they are truly mistaken, it won't happen. People refusing vaccines are only enriching the pockets of big pharmas, because right now they will continually need to make new vaccines for new variants - why not end this right now ?

I do not believe the J&J, AstraZeneca or Sputnik are good enough to protect against variants, their efficacy is far weaker - BUT even 40-50% protection is better than 0%.

You don't believe in vaccines - so what do you suggest, that we keep locking up people, shutting down businesses, can this horror continue ? How long do you think this can go on for ? You cannot ask people to stay locked up another year, no bloody way !

Right now anti-vaxxers are the ones holding society hostage - they are the cause for rising numbers and pandemic starting again with full force.

China is the only country who adopts the harsh measures to contain an outbreak - if it does happen, unfortunately other countries have clueless politicians and a population who do not think farther than their nose.

What is it gonna take for people to get vaccinated, a variant with 90% mortality ???? f'en hell....Remember if this pandemic has no end, we cannot blame the bats or the pengolin this time, it's on us..........
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