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How to legally decline a vaccine?...tasman1

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#21 by Nikorj » Sun Jan 31, 2021 01:59

Yes i know!!, But is it symbol politic or governments morons that generate the outcome of these decisions (I choose the 1st option).

What i fear more than the pandemic is a back-pedalling government government that makes irrational decisions based on fear while S....... in their pants.

We need the wise decisions and those that limits the number of infections, But our government new policy is based on what could happen not what actually might happen (imagine if we based our society on these principles in general :mrgreen: )


This a reply to Tasmans post, For some odd reason i can't reply to peoples topics (or at least it's not shown as a reply)
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#22 by Arvind9 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 02:42

Nikorj wrote: I actually want to challenge your opinion a bit here :D

Social media are always more or less dictating the majority of the public opinion, But try to imagine the situation after we have gotten more control of the pandemic and everyone can start breathing again.

If you were a business owner(that could be a restaurant/night club or even a flight company), Would you not do your outmost to make sure your customers felt safe and kept using your service?? (here i am of course talking about private businesses).

Would you as a owner of a flight company risk a lot of people getting infected on board of your plane??, Not only will you receive bad press, You will also lose customers as people will feel unsafe. I can promise you that it will be the same for all big events both outdoors and indoors.


This is a reply to Arvind9

People are so detached from society that social media is their main occupation thats why they are influenced by it,in our society People are not friendly even with their neighbors their friends are People on social media whom they have never met nor will they ever meet
Here in India the government is only trying to help the multinationals to recover from the effects of the lockdown rest all business are on their own to fend for themselves they are squeezing people for their own survival not trying to create a good opinion about themselves I have stopped buying anything from a couple of them because they started blaming me for their bad sales support,slowly many are closing down because of bad management,atleast here no one is trying to create a good opinion everyone is finding ways to survive
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#23 by Darkstar2 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:11

Arvind9 wrote: :D I kind of like your answers but in India the vaccine is free no one will have to pay for it,government is keen people take it on their own

Nothing is FREE, don't be fooled by this word, the money WILL come out of people's pockets to some capacity, wait until this pandemic is over, someone has to pay back all this free money, and it will take centuries - it is the future generations who will pay the big price, and current generation too for those fortunate (or unfortunate) to live long enough :D

I wouldn't get the bloody vaccine if you PAID me to, until I have certainty that it is 1) effective 2) safe LONG TERM. As it uses a new technology never before used in vaccines and I'm not going to be a test subject. Once it is used on a million or more people, over a long period, then maybe - I play my role and contribute by following guidelines at all times, so I am not a risk or spreader - I accept the risks of not getting vaccine - though people who are high risks, and spend their time around people most of the time, crowds, activities, etc, they should get the vaccine - and just because you get the vaccine does not mean you cannot spread the virus - in fact it creates a new problem - you are less likely to become symptomatic, and for a while you can shed the virus and still spread it. Ideally, more than 80% of the population should get the vaccine, to reach in theory, herd immunity, but is i not going to happen, there is not enough doses 1) and 2) you cannot convince 80% of the world to get the vaccine, so herd immunity is science fiction - this virus is here to stay for years to come, this coronashit virus is our new reality we have to learn to live with, just like the seasonal influenza.

P.S. If for some reason, the crocodile population increases suddenly around the world, you'll know why.....for more information, send your inquiries c/o Jair Bolsonaro :mrgreen:
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#24 by Darkstar2 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:13

Nikorj wrote: Yes i know!!, But is it symbol politic or governments morons that generate the outcome of these decisions (I choose the 1st option).

What i fear more than the pandemic is a back-pedalling government government that makes irrational decisions based on fear while S....... in their pants.

We need the wise decisions and those that limits the number of infections, But our government new policy is based on what could happen not what actually might happen (imagine if we based our society on these principles in general :mrgreen: )


This a reply to Tasmans post, For some odd reason i can't reply to peoples topics (or at least it's not shown as a reply)

If you want to reply to someone specific just click on "QUOTE" button by hovering at the top right box of their post, just like I did now............ and the day that governments will do the right thing will be the day pigs grow wings and fly backwards............oh wait, my bad, there is more odds of that happening actually :lol:
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#25 by Arvind9 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:26

Indian Pharmaceutical companies are sending it free to Brazil,Pakistani,Bangladesh and some other countries its a part of an agreement between WHO European countries India that the vaccine should be provided to countries that cannot get it on their own they are all European Pharmaceutical companies they have manufacturing facilities in India so India gets it free for its own use only when they provide it to other countries,20 million shots have been sent to Pakistan,another 20 million to Bangladesh and Brazil,I saw in the news Brazilian President thanking the Indian government to help out,yes if Brazilian government charges people for what came free then thats their matte,there are some misconceptions these Vaccine are only for Frontline workers common people will have to wait longer,In India alone there are 30 million Frontline workers,its not that there is enough doses to Vaccinate a whole population perhaps thats the case everywhere,Vaccinating the whole population will take years so why worry now as to who will have to pay that is if many are alive
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#26 by tasman1 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:24

Nikorj same question for you

If you are let say small business owner let say coffee owner

You can take 100 people and you must have minimum 70% full to just survive will you open it if you can have now only 25 in ?

Same for any business , can you operate jumbo airplane for 500 people but now you can take only 100?
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#27 by Nikorj » Sun Jan 31, 2021 14:41

Sigh Darkstar, I am very well aware on how to reply to someones post :lol:

Just tried to reply to your answer by clicking reply option, I'm hit with a strange bug :mrgreen:


(why do you think i'm editing my post)
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#28 by Nikorj » Sun Jan 31, 2021 15:00

tasman1 wrote: Nikorj same question for you

If you are let say small business owner let say coffee owner

You can take 100 people and you must have minimum 70% full to just survive will you open it if you can have now only 25 in ?

Same for any business , can you operate jumbo airplane for 500 people but now you can take only 100?

I don't get your logic Tasman.

Yes!! as a business owner i would open up for just 25 people (at least it is making you some money instead of a big fat 0)

2 coffee shops :


The one on the right have customers that are all vaccinated/tested negative for covid-19.

The one on the left don't have any requirements of any kind



Which one would most people choose (onlu 1 guess).


An example from Denmark coming up!!, This summer's biggest festival /Roskilde festivallen) Have already decided they will take all the measures they can to prevent any from entering without being 100% sure they are not infected, That will mean either a negative test or 2 shots of a vaccine.

Imagine a disaster if there suddenly came a major outbreak of covid-19 and they had to shut it down, These precautions will be followed by all other major events when they are allowed to reopen.


Huurahh, The reply button worked ???, Or maybe the system is preventing me from conversing with radicalized persons as Darkstar (Just kidding of course) :lol: :lol:
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#29 by tasman1 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 15:25

Nikorj wrote:
tasman1 wrote: Nikorj same question for you

If you are let say small business owner let say coffee owner

You can take 100 people and you must have minimum 70% full to just survive will you open it if you can have now only 25 in ?

Same for any business , can you operate jumbo airplane for 500 people but now you can take only 100?

I don't get your logic Tasman.

Yes!! as a business owner i would open up for just 25 people (at least it is making you some money instead of a big fat 0)

2 coffee shops :


The one on the right have customers that are all vaccinated/tested negative for covid-19.

The one on the left don't have any requirements of any kind



Which one would most people choose (onlu 1 guess).


An example from Denmark coming up!!, This summer's biggest festival /Roskilde festivallen) Have already decided they will take all the measures they can to prevent any from entering without being 100% sure they are not infected, That will mean either a negative test or 2 shots of a vaccine.

Imagine a disaster if there suddenly came a major outbreak of covid-19 and they had to shut it down, These precautions will be followed by all other major events when they are allowed to reopen.


Huurahh, The reply button worked ???, Or maybe the system is preventing me from conversing with radicalized persons as Darkstar (Just kidding of course) :lol: :lol:





OK , so you will open coffee shop and have only 25 person . in that case your loss will be huge , how long will you stay open , work for free and have huge loss every year ???? Remember this situation will stay for long time or maybe even forever
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#30 by Nikorj » Sun Jan 31, 2021 15:47

That is actually what most smaller businesses are doing already, When they are allowed to have open.

And you are absolutely right, This will be the normal for a long time to come.


Following the restrictions is at the moment a new way to brand your business, At some point we will actually be kind of forced to reopen. Question is : What is a responsible way to do it (And when).

if you keep everything closed until the last mutation is gone, You can be sure to kill all smaller businesses period, The big ones will of course rake in as much as they can.


Let's hope we can turn up the volume on vaccines unless we want the lockdown to last until 2025.
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#31 by tasman1 » Sun Jan 31, 2021 16:26

Nikorj wrote: That is actually what most smaller businesses are doing already, When they are allowed to have open.

And you are absolutely right, This will be the normal for a long time to come.


Following the restrictions is at the moment a new way to brand your business, At some point we will actually be kind of forced to reopen. Question is : What is a responsible way to do it (And when).

if you keep everything closed until the last mutation is gone, You can be sure to kill all smaller businesses period, The big ones will of course rake in as much as they can.


Let's hope we can turn up the volume on vaccines unless we want the lockdown to last until 2025.





No idea what can be responsible way to open business ,,,,, no business can work under 25% rule , not small , not big business , nobody can afford to have that small number of customer

Maybe it is time for universal income , maybe , not sure , maybe it will help our survival
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#32 by Darkstar2 » Mon Feb 01, 2021 09:40

tasman1 wrote: Nikorj same question for you

If you are let say small business owner let say coffee owner

You can take 100 people and you must have minimum 70% full to just survive will you open it if you can have now only 25 in ?

Same for any business , can you operate jumbo airplane for 500 people but now you can take only 100?

This is a great point Tasman1 - That's way recently they released statistics about the % of business that will shut down permanently. Some business owners will shut down and some will just re-invent themselves or change industry altogether. Unfortunately not every business owner has the resources. Luckily many restaurants here manage to survive because they have their regular customers and they do take-out and delivery - and receiving SOME help from government, but other industries are struggling like airlines and cinemas - If you have a business that REQUIRES 70% to remain in business and you are allowed only 25%, you can't stay in business for long, but it will depend on many factor, and can be different to each business - it depends on how much money the business owner has, how long can they sustain losses, how much outside help can they get, etc. this is why ANY good business should always set aside a provision for exceptional circumstances - BUT who is ever ready for a pandemic lasting 1+ years. Rules are rules, businesses have to comply, ........... Some business can invest more money to adapt their area to restrictions (plexiglass, more space between tables, etc.) One thing for sure, we will all be living a new "normal", nothing will be completely back to normal, even if the number of cases go DOWN and vaccine works, community spread will still be there, companies will have to adapt to a new reality and new way of working to avoid surge in cases - it's likely people have to adapt to this new normalcy for the years to come.

In Canada it was said that 20% of small and medium sized businesses will shut down permanently, that's A LOT of jobs ! Some businesses will compensate for the losses by increasing their rates, it's already happening, some businesses are adding "COVID fees" for example, go to the dentist, pay $30 COVID fees, go to a restaurant, pay COVID fees, even if you go take a piss you will be charged COVID fees :P As to a coffee shop, well, be creative, if you can only have 25% instead of 70%, you could still survive........the other 45% of your customers don't have to drink that coffee inside your establishment, they can order to go........this business model is more popular and it works, because people are fed the F up staying home all the time, so people want to go out, and they would get out anyway right ? but instead of sitting down inside your shop, they will order to go, so for most business in that industry it should not make a difference - the only thing is that the owner is paying rent for unused space, and paying $$$$ to adapt the area to covid19 restrictions. So at 25% your coffee shop should still be able to survive, it all comes down to proper management - restaurants and shops who have restrictions, concern only occupancy inside, but nothing prevents any shop from serving customers through the counter and drive-through, there is no limit to that. That's how all the coffee shops and restaurants are surviving here, customers are still ordering food, people are still eating during this pandemic.................... NOT ALL restaurants will survive, the high tier ones, which do not offer take out / delivery might struggle - also keep in mind that during pandemic people tend to spend less money - usually fast food and small items like coffee, pastries, etc don't suffer much - it is the refined restaurants where you leave with a $120 bill and an almost empty stomach :mrgreen:
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#33 by tasman1 » Mon Feb 01, 2021 13:15

Back to original topic

Another way to refuse vaccine is to take sledgehammer or shotgun every time you visit doctor , just in case you know
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