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It is back .........tasman1

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#1 by tasman1 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 22:40

A Sydney doctor has slammed a revitalised anti-vaccination movement that has gained traction as Australia signs a deal to secure a potential COVID-19 vaccine that would be rolled out cost-free to citizens.

Dr Zac Turner wants the federal government to curtail the freedoms of people who refuse the potential COVID-19 vaccine, including travel, and has raised the idea that businesses including shops, gyms, pubs and restaurants could refuse those who weren’t vaccinated.


Dear Dr Zac Turner

That is same politic as in Nazi Germany in World War 2

Shops to refuse entry > no food to buy = dead sentence

Hope sambody will shoot you , you are not human but pure garbage

You will take bribe and and declare any vaccine safe , what if it is not safe and you kill million ??????
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#2 by Arvind9 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 23:58

There is no vaccine so from where does this vaccine come?
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#3 by tasman1 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 23:58

Arvind9 wrote: There is no vaccine so from where does this vaccine come?



He say ... once it comes
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#4 by Arvind9 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 08:49

Actually even the vaccine is a huge problem governments may give people something that may not be effective for long just to prevent the spread of the virus, Indians think they are immune to the virus but that is not the solution they dont realize they could still have the virus and be more dangerous because not knowing they already have it and will spread it to others easily,the Indian government has allowed flights to some countries but there have already been complaints of positive cases found in those flights when carried out routine tests in the arriving country,people in Singapore are complaining against Indians saying they are not safe to be allowed entry they are infected and will spread it to us,they should be refused entry,there is already a problem with being immune or asyntomatic because they are potential carriers
Last edited by Arvind9 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 08:54 » edited 1 time in total
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#5 by Darkstar2 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 18:10

tasman1 wrote: A Sydney doctor has slammed a revitalised anti-vaccination movement that has gained traction as Australia signs a deal to secure a potential COVID-19 vaccine that would be rolled out cost-free to citizens.

Countries are signing big deals and gambling with trillions of $ of tax payer money for imaginary vaccines, that are not even out yet, not even proven and based on a load of fluff, it's amazing how much of those trillions of $ could help dying businesses, the jobless, the poor, etc. Let's see what happens next when the shit hits the fan and it turns out that the vaccine is not effective enough to curb the pandemic - but at least big pharmas will see their stock surge and run laughing to the bank, shareholders are happy, CEOs get billions bonuses, whilst the rest of the population drops like dead flies, floods hospitals, die, commit suicide and their debt burden increases ten fold.

Quote:
Dr Zac Turner wants the federal government to curtail the freedoms of people who refuse the potential COVID-19 vaccine, including travel, and has raised the idea that businesses including shops, gyms, pubs and restaurants could refuse those who weren’t vaccinated.


I hope that this doctor did not get his diploma out of a box of cereal :lol: As a doctor I hope he know that vaccines are not 100% effective. Yes vaccines have helped save millions of lives and kept outbreaks under control, but it is very unrealistic to EXPECT that the first iteration of a vaccine for the China virus will be even more than 50% effective. You cannot FORCE people to get a vaccine that has been rushed and developed by skipping some steps, I mean vaccines normally take 5-10 years, this fast tracked vaccine is based on smaller samples, shorter timelines and guessing, but it cannot address the long term effects. Nobody knows yet for how long do you get a protection, and whether the vaccine provides a reaction that is enough to completely stop the virus, or will it just half protect you......will it cause health issues, complications, will it turn us into zombies like the ones in Michael Jackson's thriller ? Nobody knows, so you cannot force people to take a bloody 1 year old vaccine. So these measures are just unrealistic. Though I do agree to some extent that those who did not get a vaccine should be subject to more scrutiny to help stop spread of the virus, like wearing a mask in public and distancing, but come on, who is going to police each individual. To resolve this issue, they should just impose covid19 measures to EVERYBODY, vaccine or not, like wearing of masks and distance, until enough time passes to prove that the vaccine is significantly reducing spread, and until daily cases are brought down to very low risk and level off, but vaccine or not, the risks will always be there. No flu vaccine completely reduce the risk of Flu, there are still half a million who die each year, and they are not restricted because they did not get the Flu shot.


Quote:
You will take bribe and and declare any vaccine safe , what if it is not safe and you kill million ??????

I hope you do understand that the whole industry of vaccines is nothing more than politics and money interest. Yes vaccines have saved lives, but traditional ones, that took years to develop. But now, there is a big race on who wins first and pockets the money, the whole vaccine now has become a money game, and politicians have a vested interest in the pharmas since they pumped trillions of $ - and since we all know that politicians are crooked liars, they will mangle the truth, sugar coat things, and overlook important steps - for governments and shareholders, money comes first, over safety - it's not uncommon for companies to gamble on risks, and even if they get slapped with a lawsuit later, they settle for millions, quietly, and continue business as usual, and their bottom line is not even hurt at all.
They even keep reserves for that sort of thing. So watch out for the upcoming propaganda, a safe vaccine, fear mongering to push people to get it - then years later you will see reports of people developing crippling diseases as a result of the vaccine.

The FDA has said it would approve any vaccine that is at minimum 50% effective - wow, that's how desperate they are, but 50% ? How the HELL is that going to stop a pandemic, we are billions of people..........
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#6 by Darkstar2 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 18:11

Arvind9 wrote: There is no vaccine so from where does this vaccine come?

On xmas eve, Santa will drop vaccine doses down people's chimneys :mrgreen:
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#7 by Darkstar2 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 18:20

Arvind9 wrote: Actually even the vaccine is a huge problem governments may give people something that may not be effective for long just to prevent the spread of the virus,

To prevent the spread, the entire population would require a lobotomy and reprogram of brain, to follow all rules :D
OR if people just wash their bloody hands properly, apply sanitary measures, wear their masks properly and at all times in public places, indoors, and avoid high risk activities like crowding, then the spread will stop !
The vaccine will NOT stop the virus nor the spread, there is no 100% vaccine. In fact, current studies show so far that the protection fades out within only 2 months ! That's VERY alarming. No new studies yet to show whether the T memory cells can manage to protect us against covid19 by making new antibodies....whatever happens, the vaccine will be just a band aid solution, protection will be short, but what happens after that ? nobody knows yet, these are the things that would normally take more studies, not things you would know on a vaccine that is released in less than 1 year.

Quote:
Indians think they are immune to the virus

How ? What rare they basing this claim on ? It is very unlikely they have reached herd immunity, not even close, and even so, if immunity is short term, you cannot have herd immunity. Already there are studies that show that some people were infected more than once, over weeks, this is VERY BAD. It's likely this virus will develop new strains, so perpetual immunity is not possible, much like the Flu, you are not permanently immune, so why would covid19 be different ? What studies do show though is that some people have a natural immunity against the virus and will never get infected - what factors determine why some people are already immune is still unknown - is it because some people were extremely ill with the Flu, cold, or another coronavirus, is it genetic, are some people's immune system stronger ? do some people have less ACE2 receptors in their lungs ? Again, it's too soon to tell, and no trillions of $ will bypass medical science, because now we are dabbling in science fiction :D
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#8 by Arvind9 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 18:35

Those who dont fall sick they think they are immune,sence of imagination is very weak ,India is now the hotspot for Covid19 with 70,000 new cases everyday,in India many Indians define a lockdown as being in Quarantine maybe their life is hit quite hard
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#9 by Darkstar2 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 19:01

Arvind9 wrote: Those who dont fall sick they think they are immune,sence of imagination is very weak ,India is now the hotspot for Covid19 with 70,000 new cases everyday

There is a half truth. Majority of people will not get severe complications from COVID19. People don't die of COVID19, people die of a severe and uncontrolled immune response through Cytokine storm. Some people might be asymptomatic and spread the virus, but there is much debate on that still regarding the timeline. Some people's immunity responds well and does not go into a severe inflammatory response, so technically yes if you could in theory get an immune response and recover from COVID19 without complications and mild to no symptoms, BUT will that immunity last ? So far studies show that NO. Could our memory cells kick in and recognise the virus ? nobody knows, and nobody CAN know, since none of the current trials involve intentionally infecting people with the virus....so everything now is based on models / guessing. All they can know in these studies is whether the vaccine produces a response and whether there were side effects and complications SHORT TERM...

NOBODY can assume they are immune unless they get tested, and even if you get it once and recover, you may not necessarily be protected for a new infection.

Some people claim they are immune because they are 1) Not old 2) Active and very healthy 3) Take vitamins, supplements, eat the right foods, are vegetarians,etc. Well this is a big mistake - the virus does not discriminate, it is now proven to attack young and old, healthy and sick. Even people who are active without a single risk factor, have had severe complications and died. The whole "only old people with existing conditions die" was an EARLY assumption when scientists did not have much information on the virus, but now things are changing, now it is not just a respiratory virus, but one that attacks, the heart, blood vessels, kidneys, brain, nervous system, etc. It's a mf of a virus that should be taken very seriously. Some kids / teens laughed at the virus thinking they are invincible, and now they are regretting every bit of it as they lie in a hospital with a respirator and hooked to machines, fighting for their life, with maybe hours to days to live.
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#10 by Arvind9 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 05:17

Yes but testing in India is very low,many people think even the tests carried out are not reliabe,a test costs Rs 4,500 many people dont want to pay that think it should be free for those who cannot afford it,but nothing is free so most people are moving freely with lockdown restrictions being lifted,terms like herd immunity asyntomatic immune are very common,people say in India immunity is high but ignore the fact that due to lack of testing many could be infected with no symptoms
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#11 by josealvesjr » Fri Aug 21, 2020 06:01

Arvind9 wrote: Yes but testing in India is very low,many people think even the tests carried out are not reliabe,a test costs Rs 4,500 many people dont want to pay that think it should be free for those who cannot afford it,but nothing is free so most people are moving freely with lockdown restrictions being lifted,terms like herd immunity asyntomatic immune are very common,people say in India immunity is high but ignore the fact that due to lack of testing many could be infected with no symptoms

Testing on mass scale has to be for free for all, all around the world. If people would like to be tested but can´t afford to, there is no reason to test the ones who can afford because one way or another they will be infected later. That is a vicous circle.
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#12 by Arvind9 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 06:12

Government hospitals are not well equipped to provide enough,so naturally the government asked private hospitals to do it but they refused to do it free,they say minimum cost for a test would be Rs4500,the government has collected billions in Covid19 funds they can pay to provide free testing for those who cannot afford it but the government wont pay even from the funds collected making people speculate about what the government could be doing with the billions collected
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#13 by josealvesjr » Fri Aug 21, 2020 06:25

Arvind9 wrote: Government hospitals are not well equipped to provide enough,so naturally the government asked private hospitals to do it but they refused to do it free,they say minimum cost for a test would be Rs4500,the government has collected billions in Covid19 funds they can pay to provide free testing for those who cannot afford it but the government wont pay even from the funds collected making people speculate about what the government could be doing with the billions collected

That is sad and bad, because in situations like this the people look and turn to their government for guidance, action, leadership, compassion and responsibility. Where else is a government for. It is also about the economical benefit of the country to address this with all possible means . Unfortunately, I´m afraid that this not only happens in your country.
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#14 by Darkstar2 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 07:35

Arvind9 wrote: Yes but testing in India is very low,many people think even the tests carried out are not reliabe,a test costs Rs 4,500 many people dont want to pay that think it should be free for those who cannot afford it,but nothing is free so most people are moving freely with lockdown restrictions being lifted,terms like herd immunity asyntomatic immune are very common,people say in India immunity is high but ignore the fact that due to lack of testing many could be infected with no symptoms

In countries with a public health system, testing is free, (I think), at least in Canada it is, I think it is free in the U.S. though I am not sure. But governments are spending trillions of $ in stimulus and vaccines, they might as well include testing too, it would be logic. As far as testing, it is not 100% effective, there are some false negatives, and not all tests are done properly....... What if the swab doesn't pick up the virus at the time of testing ? You could test negative the first time, get COVID19 next day from someone, and never know it, go asymptomatic. Currently the only most used test is the swab test where they insert a 10 foot long swab up your nostril and into your brain stem :mrgreen: not a pleasant test, so I think some people are afraid to get tested because of that, and another swab in the back of your throat. If somehow they had a portable test anybody can use at home, it would encourage more testing.
They say that saliva testing is not as effective, and yet other experts say that it could be just as effective as the current swab method.

I don't know why in India ANYBODY claims herd immunity, on what basis ? It could be that a majority of people carrying and spreading the virus is asymptomatic, but even if 75% of Indian population was positive, this so-called immunity would be short lived. Studies so far show that antibodies fade within 60 days, and it is unclear if long term immunity is possible, there is no news about that yet. People usually go get tested when they feel symptoms or when their symptoms are severe enough, or when they must go to the hospital, where automatically they must get tested.

Arvind9 wrote: Government hospitals are not well equipped to provide enough,so naturally the government asked private hospitals to do it but they refused to do it free,they say minimum cost for a test would be Rs4500,the government has collected billions in Covid19 funds they can pay to provide free testing for those who cannot afford it but the government wont pay even from the funds collected making people speculate about what the government could be doing with the billions collected

This is a question of extreme emergency and public health and safety, testing must be made available to those who cannot afford it - this is a health crisis - China should be the one to pay the bill, they created this mess!
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#15 by tasman1 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 14:59

Darkstar2 wrote:
Arvind9 wrote: There is no vaccine so from where does this vaccine come?

On xmas eve, Santa will drop vaccine doses down people's chimneys :mrgreen:




On xmas eve, Santa will drop Poison doses down people's chimneys :twisted: instant stop of suffering worldwide :o
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#16 by Darkstar2 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 15:23

You repeated exactly what I said Tasman1, Santa will drop vaccine doses down the chimneys :lol:
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#17 by tasman1 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 16:02

Poison Santa , that is maybe good name for product
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#18 by Darkstar2 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 18:12

tasman1 wrote: Poison Santa , that is maybe good name for product

One thing I know for sure, Santa will deliver large bags of money to CEOs and shareholders of big pharmas, you know, the ones who will make billions of $ on a half baked vaccine..........Meanwhile, COVID19 mutation #77 will ravage cities all over the globe and continue to decimate population !
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